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	<title>Comments for trainingwreck</title>
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	<link>http://www.danpontefract.com</link>
	<description>Dan Pontefract: helping to lead the learning and enterprise 2.0 revolution</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 08 Sep 2010 17:00:50 -0700</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on So The LMS Is Dead: Collaboration-Talent Convergence is Next by Richard Harbridge</title>
		<link>http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=519&#038;cpage=1#comment-5776</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Harbridge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Sep 2010 17:00:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=519#comment-5776</guid>
		<description>P.S - Of the last 10 projects I did relating to HR or people development and training all of them touched upon Talent Management and all of them utilized SharePoint which is not a &#039;proper&#039; talent management system.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>P.S &#8211; Of the last 10 projects I did relating to HR or people development and training all of them touched upon Talent Management and all of them utilized SharePoint which is not a &#8216;proper&#8217; talent management system.</p>
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		<title>Comment on So The LMS Is Dead: Collaboration-Talent Convergence is Next by Richard Harbridge</title>
		<link>http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=519&#038;cpage=1#comment-5775</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Harbridge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Sep 2010 16:58:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=519#comment-5775</guid>
		<description>I think there is already some convergence in this area: Collaboration and Talent Management especially in relation to simple things like expertise search, and social features now available in collaborative environments. (I can talk at length about this in the SharePoint space.)

Take simple systems that deal with employee file management or those processes mentioned above - I know of hundreds of organizations who currently use collaboration, content management, and business process management systems to support all employee (and talent) related processes. 

The difficulty in part is that historically collaboration technologies and their adoption is driven from IT where as Talent Management is driven from HR. As these groups adopt each others platforms (or the technology stretches out using new features/capabilities like social) the boundary lines will diminish and you will see the convergence you, I and many others want to see happen. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think there is already some convergence in this area: Collaboration and Talent Management especially in relation to simple things like expertise search, and social features now available in collaborative environments. (I can talk at length about this in the SharePoint space.)</p>
<p>Take simple systems that deal with employee file management or those processes mentioned above &#8211; I know of hundreds of organizations who currently use collaboration, content management, and business process management systems to support all employee (and talent) related processes. </p>
<p>The difficulty in part is that historically collaboration technologies and their adoption is driven from IT where as Talent Management is driven from HR. As these groups adopt each others platforms (or the technology stretches out using new features/capabilities like social) the boundary lines will diminish and you will see the convergence you, I and many others want to see happen. <img src='http://www.danpontefract.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>Comment on So The LMS Is Dead: Collaboration-Talent Convergence is Next by Jon Husband</title>
		<link>http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=519&#038;cpage=1#comment-5744</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Husband</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Sep 2010 17:38:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=519#comment-5744</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt; But, to truly gain traction, the ‘human capital’ processes found within the ‘talent management’ space (such as performance reviews, learning management, onboarding/induction, succession planning, retention and attraction practices, compensation protocols, etc.) really need to have collaboration practices built into it.&lt;/i&gt;

Yes, and ... 

Most of the functional aspects of Talent Mgt that you have described above are derived from or related to job descriptions and org&#039;nl &#039;structure&#039; that have yet to be substantively addressed in terms of the changes need to enable / support / reinforce a connected-and-collaborative work environment (yes, I know (or believe) you and your colleagues have done some thinking and / or work in this respect, but there&#039;s many aspects of this &#039;framework&#039; that offer significant potential for dissonance.

I also know this is a niggling point, but I&#039;d prefer to grow, attract and celebrate the effective use of talent (and yes, I&#039;d include a succession plan) rather than &#039;manage&#039; it, in an increasingly difficult-to-predict world.

There are applications / web services coming along that will help in this regard, I believe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i> But, to truly gain traction, the ‘human capital’ processes found within the ‘talent management’ space (such as performance reviews, learning management, onboarding/induction, succession planning, retention and attraction practices, compensation protocols, etc.) really need to have collaboration practices built into it.</i></p>
<p>Yes, and &#8230; </p>
<p>Most of the functional aspects of Talent Mgt that you have described above are derived from or related to job descriptions and org&#8217;nl &#8217;structure&#8217; that have yet to be substantively addressed in terms of the changes need to enable / support / reinforce a connected-and-collaborative work environment (yes, I know (or believe) you and your colleagues have done some thinking and / or work in this respect, but there&#8217;s many aspects of this &#8216;framework&#8217; that offer significant potential for dissonance.</p>
<p>I also know this is a niggling point, but I&#8217;d prefer to grow, attract and celebrate the effective use of talent (and yes, I&#8217;d include a succession plan) rather than &#8216;manage&#8217; it, in an increasingly difficult-to-predict world.</p>
<p>There are applications / web services coming along that will help in this regard, I believe.</p>
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		<title>Comment on SharePoint 2010: The New Employee Gateway? by JustinF</title>
		<link>http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=254&#038;cpage=1#comment-5075</link>
		<dc:creator>JustinF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Aug 2010 07:53:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=254#comment-5075</guid>
		<description>Dan, The LMS portion of this Blog was truly insightful and the links proved to be very helpful to me. Many thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dan, The LMS portion of this Blog was truly insightful and the links proved to be very helpful to me. Many thanks!</p>
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		<title>Comment on IT &amp; HR: Should They Merge? by Rotkapchen</title>
		<link>http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=499&#038;cpage=1#comment-5046</link>
		<dc:creator>Rotkapchen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Aug 2010 03:28:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=499#comment-5046</guid>
		<description>BTW, your equation is spot on. I&#039;ve regularly used 2 of the 3, but all 3 are relevant.

What I&#039;d like to see now are all the reasons why it won&#039;t happen (the reality check).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BTW, your equation is spot on. I&#8217;ve regularly used 2 of the 3, but all 3 are relevant.</p>
<p>What I&#8217;d like to see now are all the reasons why it won&#8217;t happen (the reality check).</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Org Structure of Enterprise 2.0 by Wan</title>
		<link>http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=343&#038;cpage=1#comment-4584</link>
		<dc:creator>Wan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Aug 2010 16:49:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=343#comment-4584</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s interesting to see the similarities between Enterprise 2.0 and technology adoption Life Cycle. Based on the diagram, we will definitely falls into the middle stage - Early Majority &amp; Late Majority for many years to come.

This is because we are driven by a strong sense of practicality in their decision making processes. The content to wait to see how others are faring before committing to what could be a “passing fad”. In addition, we are comfortable with the application of new technology comprises about one-third of the total buying population.

On the other hand, late majority will make us wait until a technology becomes a standard before buying into it, wanting to see lots of support and tend to buy from well established enterprises. Finally, we are not so confident as the early majority with their ability to handle the new technology 
that comprises about one-third of the total buying population.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s interesting to see the similarities between Enterprise 2.0 and technology adoption Life Cycle. Based on the diagram, we will definitely falls into the middle stage &#8211; Early Majority &amp; Late Majority for many years to come.</p>
<p>This is because we are driven by a strong sense of practicality in their decision making processes. The content to wait to see how others are faring before committing to what could be a “passing fad”. In addition, we are comfortable with the application of new technology comprises about one-third of the total buying population.</p>
<p>On the other hand, late majority will make us wait until a technology becomes a standard before buying into it, wanting to see lots of support and tend to buy from well established enterprises. Finally, we are not so confident as the early majority with their ability to handle the new technology<br />
that comprises about one-third of the total buying population.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Mintzberg, Managing &amp; the Missing Element of Collaboration by paul</title>
		<link>http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=487&#038;cpage=1#comment-4411</link>
		<dc:creator>paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 19:45:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=487#comment-4411</guid>
		<description>Dan, I&#039;ve not read his book yet (sigh ... too many books, too little time), but some have criticized Mintzberg for failing to draw a clear distinction between managers and leaders.  And secondly, for focusing too much on manager as a &quot;position&quot; rather than &quot;managing&quot; as a process.  Do you think these are fair assessments?

Also, in his diagram, Figure 3.2, what is referring to when he mentions &quot;controlling&quot;?  And how does that play out w.r.t. your point about collaboration?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dan, I&#8217;ve not read his book yet (sigh &#8230; too many books, too little time), but some have criticized Mintzberg for failing to draw a clear distinction between managers and leaders.  And secondly, for focusing too much on manager as a &#8220;position&#8221; rather than &#8220;managing&#8221; as a process.  Do you think these are fair assessments?</p>
<p>Also, in his diagram, Figure 3.2, what is referring to when he mentions &#8220;controlling&#8221;?  And how does that play out w.r.t. your point about collaboration?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Mintzberg, Managing &amp; the Missing Element of Collaboration by Jon Husband</title>
		<link>http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=487&#038;cpage=1#comment-4384</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Husband</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jul 2010 19:57:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=487#comment-4384</guid>
		<description>Glad you enjoyed it, Dan.  I agree with your point, &lt;b&gt;and&lt;/b&gt; I notice that Mintzberg&#039;s quote says &quot;through people&quot;.  Also, when he refers to &quot;a dynamic balance&quot; between the three planes, I am guessing or inferring that he is referring to these in a networked environment.  He saw the (coming) organization as a web or a series of flows (viz. organigraphs) a decade or more ago.

 I think he has written relatively often about collaboration (I am going to go check) and of course one of his main activities these days is collaborative coaching, at www.coachingourselves.com

Here, for example, is &lt;a href=&quot;http://temafrank.tripod.com/id31.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;a 10-year old interview with Mintzberg&lt;/a&gt; that is mostly about collaboration and managing.  I&#039;d argue that the key points (in bold) are directly applicable to today&#039;s context.

I&#039;d have to re-read it, but from what I remember his 2004 book &lt;i&gt;&quot;Managers, not MBAs: A hard look at the soft practice of managing and management development&quot;&lt;/i&gt; also had a fair bit in it on the importance of developing managers able to work in / with collaboration.

So .. my assumption is that Mintzberg considers the form(s) of managing he is exploring in his latest book as having to adapt to the conditions that today are creating an increased (real &amp; pragmatic) interest in collaboration and collaborative work / management practices.

But, good catch. Makes me think ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Glad you enjoyed it, Dan.  I agree with your point, <b>and</b> I notice that Mintzberg&#8217;s quote says &#8220;through people&#8221;.  Also, when he refers to &#8220;a dynamic balance&#8221; between the three planes, I am guessing or inferring that he is referring to these in a networked environment.  He saw the (coming) organization as a web or a series of flows (viz. organigraphs) a decade or more ago.</p>
<p> I think he has written relatively often about collaboration (I am going to go check) and of course one of his main activities these days is collaborative coaching, at <a href="http://www.coachingourselves.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.coachingourselves.com</a></p>
<p>Here, for example, is <a href="http://temafrank.tripod.com/id31.htm" rel="nofollow">a 10-year old interview with Mintzberg</a> that is mostly about collaboration and managing.  I&#8217;d argue that the key points (in bold) are directly applicable to today&#8217;s context.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d have to re-read it, but from what I remember his 2004 book <i>&#8220;Managers, not MBAs: A hard look at the soft practice of managing and management development&#8221;</i> also had a fair bit in it on the importance of developing managers able to work in / with collaboration.</p>
<p>So .. my assumption is that Mintzberg considers the form(s) of managing he is exploring in his latest book as having to adapt to the conditions that today are creating an increased (real &amp; pragmatic) interest in collaboration and collaborative work / management practices.</p>
<p>But, good catch. Makes me think &#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Standalone LMS is Dead by Dan Pontefract</title>
		<link>http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=152&#038;cpage=1#comment-4316</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Pontefract</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 16:53:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=152#comment-4316</guid>
		<description>@Sloane - thanks for your comments.

@Dawn - yes indeed, saw your post and remarked &quot;Bingo!&quot;. Nice work. Thanks for the great piece - well written.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Sloane &#8211; thanks for your comments.</p>
<p>@Dawn &#8211; yes indeed, saw your post and remarked &#8220;Bingo!&#8221;. Nice work. Thanks for the great piece &#8211; well written.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Mintzberg, Managing &amp; the Missing Element of Collaboration by Dan Pontefract</title>
		<link>http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=487&#038;cpage=1#comment-4315</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Pontefract</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 16:51:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.danpontefract.com/?p=487#comment-4315</guid>
		<description>Thanks Howard. 

#1 - agreed, Education 2.0 and the Long Tail, along with networks of learning is going to be a very important part

#2 - I believe it&#039;s to collaborate with others in addition to designing the experiences him/herself (ie. a combo) that will help drive the panacea experience</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Howard. </p>
<p>#1 &#8211; agreed, Education 2.0 and the Long Tail, along with networks of learning is going to be a very important part</p>
<p>#2 &#8211; I believe it&#8217;s to collaborate with others in addition to designing the experiences him/herself (ie. a combo) that will help drive the panacea experience</p>
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